Bachelor of Science in Land Surveying

Institution: 
Cincinnati State Technical & Community College
Approval Status: 
In Review
Comment Period: 
Fri, 12/08/2017 - 11:00am to Fri, 12/22/2017 - 11:00am

Comments

Comment: 
As the Executive Director of the Professional Land Surveyors of Ohio, it is clear that this industry is in need of the next generation of land surveyors. The average age of current licensed professionals is approximately 60, and land surveyors are retiring faster than they are being replaced by new professionals. By providing an educational opportunity for students in the Southwest Ohio area, Cincinnati State Technical and Community College will be filling an important need within the industry. Our members and their companies in the region are especially supportive of this program, and look forward to the chance to employ graduates who have the appropriate education to move forward with the licensure process as future land surveyors. Our organization is pleased to whole-heartedly support the application for the CSTCC to offer an Applied Bachelor's Degree in Land Surveying, and encourage the approval of this program for the industry and workforce development needs in the future. Sincerely, Melinda Gilpin Executive Director Professional Land Surveyors of Ohio, Inc.

Comment: 
This program will help fill an IMPORTANT workforce development need in the mid-west region. Land surveyors have an average age of 60, and are retiring faster than new professionals are replacing them. Cinci State is one of the few places in the midwest that provides the opportunity to obtain the appropriate education to pursue a career in land surveying and there is not an available program in the region that offers higher-level education in land surveying. The County Engineer in each of the 88 counties has a requirement of being a professional engineer and a professional surveyor because they are the surveyor for the county so the county engineer and their staff in the mapping department review and approve any land transfer or split. Its a struggle to find staff that have the experience as they are retiring with 30+ year experience. We have 7 on our staff right now that have 20+ years with our professional surveyors license and many are approaching retirement and will be leaving our county with a void. When one retired last year, we struggled to find a replacement because students are choosing the profession due to pay and availability of obtaining the education. The private land surveyors are experiencing the same problem. Without this program, the state of Ohio and other states could start to have a crisis situation if there are not professionals filling these positions. When i obtained my professional surveyors license i was fortunate that there was about 15 of us in northwest Ohio that needed our 24 surveying hours and cinci state was able to bring us the classes to us on with a one time program. Right now, there is a void of professionals being able to obtain their professional surveyor requirement and this program is desperately needed.

Comment: 
WE NEED THIS BADLY !! I am looking for a licensed surveyor to sell and take over my active and very busy suvey firm. They are not in this region. Please allow this to happen, as many many others are in the same position as I. Ohio is growing, and needs more Professional Land Surveyors as they are retiring faster than others are obtaining their license due to the lack of institutions offering this Bachelor Degree. Also as note, we could use a credited "on-line version of this as well as many of the qualified and experience field surveyors cannot go to a regular daytime college. Thank youi

Comment: 
This program will fill an important role in helping to increase the number of licensed surveyors entering the workforce in Ohio. Land surveyors in Ohio are retiring faster than new professionals are replacing them. There is no college in the region that offers higher level education in land surveying, so students that achieve an associates degree in surveying from Cincinnati State are stuck at the technician level because there is nowhere for them to go to finish their education locally. Cincinnati State offers a quality education at an affordable price. I attended Cincinnati State, and earned associates degrees in not only surveying, but environmental engineering as well. The program at University of Cincinnati where I earned my Bachelor's degree in Land Surveying is no longer available, but quite honestly, it did little to further my knowledge of surveying. Everything I learned of value came from Cincinnati State. Further, I feel that offering a Bachelor's program in Surveying at Cincinnati State would widen the pool of candidates that we can choose from to fill positions at the technician level. More students would choose surveying as a field of study knowing that they can do something with it when they have completed their education. Here at the City of Cincinnati, we would gladly hire on surveying students, and then assist them with the tuition to finish their education in the evening, should that be an option the school chooses to offer. This could do nothing but improve the surveying field, and the students' prospects. Thank you.

Comment: 
This bill is needed in order to insure the future of the surveying profession in this area.

Comment: 
The Land Survey program at Cincinnati State is desperately need to promote future Professional Surveyors. Being a Past President of the Professional Land Surveyors of Ohio and Past Chairman of the education committee, I understand the need of a Bachelor's Degree in Land Surveying for the State of Ohio. I recently retired from the profession being one of the last active surveyors in our county. At one time we had 4 active companies in our county. Today, we have one active full time surveyor in the county and he is 67 years old. We are losing more surveyors due to retirement CAthan the State can replace. The new degree program will not only help the Cincinnati Region but the whole State of Ohio including Northwestern part of Ohio were I am from. I urge you to serious consider the creation of the program to help eliminate the storage of Professional Surveyors in Ohio.

Comment: 
The ability for Cincinnati State to obtain an accreditation for a Land Surveying Degree is monumental for the future of this profession, both in the public and private sectors. I am a graduate of The Cincinnati State - NKU articulation agreement and while it has been beneficial to me it would be great to see Cincinnati State provide a stand alone education that could serve the entire Tri-State area. The education I received while at Cincinnati State was invaluable and I cannot stress enough how great the educators that lead the program at the college are. I currently work for a mid-size Engineering and Land Surveying firm in the Dayton region and I can attest to the struggles that others on this board have mentioned. We spent the better part of a year attempting to find a solid Surveying candidate and even though we eventually did find a great employee, it was taxing on our resources and time. Allowing for this program would ensure that the southwestern portion of the state continues to cultivate a new and sustainable workforce for years to come. I fully support the development and implementation of this degree and look forward to seeing the Surveying Profession benefit as a result.

Comment: 
The Applied Bachelor's Degree in Land Surveying will provide a critically needed pathway for students to become Licensed Surveyors in the State of Ohio. Surveyors are retiring more quickly than new one's are becoming licensed. Cincinnati State will provide the region with exemplary Surveyors for years to come if this program is approved. As other's have noted, this program must be available for non-traditional students. Many students need the flexibility of on-line and evening classes since they are working in the field throughout their education.

Comment: 
As someone who decided to pursue land surveying licensure after being in the industry for more than ten years, the addition of a bachelors degree program for surveying to the cincinnati state program offerings would be a great help. It would alleviate the need to transfer to expensive, unrelated programs which I have no interest in, make my educational path faster and more affordable, and provide better preparation for my future aspirations. I can attest that there is a shortage licensed individuals and students pursuing licensure, as I have been contacted by companies other than my current employer who are attempting to recruit future professional land surveyors because they cannot find applicants who are currently licensed. This program will provide individuals in the Cincinnati area who are interested in the field of land surveying with a clear path to attain their goal-resulting in more future surveyors. I would also like to point out that automated mapping and other technological advances may reduce the need for low level technicians, it requires professionals with experience to do boundary work. The demand for boundary work is increasing as a result of stricter regulations for property transfer at county levels. While these regulations vary from county to county the trend is universal. As an example, I will point to Hamilton County, which no longer accepts "exceptions" from legal descriptions. This means that if you want to sell 5 acres from a 50 acre tract - the entire tract must be surveyed, not just the new parcel. Increased liability has also had an effect on the amount of professional involvement required to complete a project. Respectfully, Ryan Maxwell

Comment: 
Without an available program in this region to offer higher level education in land surveying, we experience increasing difficulty hiring licensed surveyors to support our communities with civil engineering and land surveying. Much of our ability related to projects is held in the hands of skilled land surveyors to provide critical information for our design engineers. Land surveyors are a crucial component to our business, and positions often go unfilled for many months as we search for talent. We have supported the two-year degree by hiring Coops, and offering full-time opportunities after graduation. We are fully prepared to hire students in a new four-year land surveying program and offer tuition assistance. We stand ready to assist with developing a workforce to meet the needs for the profession now and into the future.

Comment: 
The ability for Cincinnati State to offer a Bachelor's degree program in Land Surveying would fill a gap in the regional offerings available to prospective surveyors. With the profession requiring a Bachelor's degree it is critical to have multiple programs available in Ohio. Right now there are more surveyors by far nearing retirement than those starting a career in Ohio, making it even more important provide easier entry paths into the profession by having degree programs locally instead of requiring students to go out of state.

Comment: 
A Bachelor of Science program in Land Surveying would serve a vital need in the Tri-State, especially since there isn't another program offering higher level Land Surveying education in the area. Design firms need competent, well trained and educated surveyors to provide detailed information for our projects. Right now there is a huge need for talent and this program will help fill that need. Design firms are interested in assisting with developing a workforce that will help meet the demand for future development. We have supported the existing program by offering employment to both co-ops and full time employees. This bachelor's program will help backfill the gap that exists as current surveyors retire and will help us prepare for future development in the area by producing well educated, knowledgeable surveyors capable of contributing immediately upon graduation.

Comment: 
Getting this program available to this region/area, I can pursue getting my License. This has been a emphasis in my future goals within the firm I work for. I’m a family man that has adult responsibilities and can’t relocate for a degree with in this survey field. I have been practicing under a few PS’s but want to get my License due to the ageing of my superiors. This is a very difficult program to get with the availabilities which are almost zero in this area for the education. YES, I could get my degree from Cincinnati State and transfer to Northern Kentucky to fulfill my degree requirements, but this adds another 1hr drive time to my already 2-hour commute to work and back from the Dayton Ohio area. With the need and growth that our city and suburbs are seeing and the ageing of our current P.L.S options it doesn’t look good at our future construction. Of enhancing the communities. We need to keep this work local with offering this type of program to assist and help the interested people the opportunity to fulfill this profession.

Comment: 
The proposed program at Cincinnati State is an absolute must for this region. It would take away a severe roadblock to pursuing a bachelors degree in land surveying and eventual licensing. The most traveled path, as of now, isn't convenient or completely dedicated to land surveying. This turns off many from pursuing a career in this field or continuing their education past what Cincinnati State is currently allowed to offer. The John R. Jurgensen Company has previously voiced their support of this bill and does so again for this next step. Land surveying needs will do nothing but expand in the coming years and the shortage of licensed surveyors has been well documented. The addition of this program can help alleviate this upcoming problem while providing a great institution the tools to implement what is necessary to keep land surveying moving forward in the future.

Comment: 
Cincinnati State is a well respected technical school and has earned the right to be. I went through the program starting in 2012 and finished the 3 + 2 program with Northern Kentucky University in the spring of 2017. Given Cincinnati State could offer the bachelors degree, the school could offer a faster track to graduation, less expensive degree (Cincinnati State is a tremendous amount cheaper than anywhere else), more core classes on Surveying (instead of Construction Management or otherwise), and graduates would most likely be more prepared for Licensure because they will have more time with core curriculum. The industry is in need of more Surveyors and with this program, individuals would be more likely to pursue the degree and obtain their License.

Comment: 
Over time, the Civil Engineering degree has abandoned land surveying as part of its curriculum. Land Surveying is a discipline that is dependent on STEM skills of students. The BS degree is required in the State of Ohio for professional registration. To not support the State's efforts to insure that the public interests are protected, means that some of our brightest students may leave our area in order to pursue their goal of becoming a professional land surveyor. The Civil Engineering programs have abandoned land surveying as part of their required curricula. Applied Science programs offer a practical means of filling this void. Emeritus Professor of Civil Engineering University of Cincinnati

Comment: 
The Civil Engineering curriculum has abandoned land surveying as a requirement. Yet, a BS degree in land surveying is required by the State of Ohio for professional registration. Students who require the BS degree are some of our brightest STEM students. If the State does not supply the opportunity, it may force our best to leave the State to find the program that they need. Emeritus Professor of Civil Engineering University of Cincinnati

Comment: 
Given the fact that a four year degree is one of the requirements in the state of Ohio in order to become licensed, and the current process for achieving this is both expensive and inconvenient to have to transfer schools, there is no question that a four year program at Cincinnati State would be much more appealing and successful for the future surveyor. It is a definite challenge to attract new blood into the profession, especially once it is explained what is required from an individual to obtain a license. I can speak from experience in saying that while I attended Cincinnati State, I learned very specific skills needed to excel in the field. The attention to the individual student due to smaller class size, the dedication of the instructors, and the reasonable tuition, is exactly what the profession of land surveying needs in order to groom well rounded and thoroughly educated individuals that are more than prepared to fill the demand that currently exists and continues to grow. I will be enrolling in this program, when and if it is offered.

Comment: 
I think a BS in Land Surveying is a huge need in the state of Ohio. There is an increasing demand for licensed surveyors and the options for becoming licensed right now are not the most practical in my opinion. I have completed the route of CSTCC to NKU in order to become licensed, but it makes much more sense to me to complete a focused degree in Surveying vs. Construction Management. I feel that CSTCC provides students with the technical skills to prepare them for a career in surveying after graduation. This degree would provide students with a more cost effective path to becoming licensed, while giving them the knowledge needed to be successful. CSTCC is in a position to produce the next generation of land surveyors, as they have proven over time, and this degree will make that process more seamless. I feel that having a clean path to licensure is important for prospective students, and right now that is not an option in the region. This is an important issue to address because the number of licensed land surveyors in the state is continuing to diminish and needs some real attention to prevent a major shortage in the near future. I think giving CSTCC the opportunity to provide this bachelor degree is a huge step in doing so.

Comment: 
I am a graduate of Cincinnati State Surveying program and the Deputy County Surveyor for the Hamilton County Engineer's Office. I have worked with many Surveyors who also graduated from Cincinnati State. I/we are not getting any younger and new Surveyors are needed. I would not have become a Surveyor if not for the surveying program being offered locally at Cincinnati State. I believe this region will assist with the Surveying workforce development in order to meet the future needs.

Comment: 
I am a graduate of Cincinnati State Surveying program and the Deputy County Surveyor for the Hamilton County Engineer's Office. I have worked with many Surveyors who also graduated from Cincinnati State. I/we are not getting any younger and new Surveyors are needed. I would not have become a Surveyor if not for the surveying program being offered locally at Cincinnati State. I believe this region will assist with the Surveying workforce development in order to meet the future needs.

Comment: 
The proposal includes this statement: “The majority of the students attend Northern Kentucky University, while a handful have attended University of Cincinnati in Applied Administration to complete their bachelor degree requirements. Neither of these pathways include any surveying courses once they leave Cincinnati State. These pathways are difficult to navigate and are more expensive and longer than necessary.” We disagree with the proposal’s comments about “difficult to navigate” and “longer than necessary." Students come in as a junior with a straight-forward curriculum. UC's tuition is higher than Cincinnati State, and we can’t argue with the fact that we don’t include surveying courses in the last 2 years. These comments aside, we have no significant concerns that should impede this proposal.

Comment: 
The University of Akron (UA) does not support this proposal. This program would be redundant with UA’s B.S. Surveying program (which is highly acclaimed and accredited). Our program has several 100% online and hybrid (online lecture combined with face-to-face weekend lab courses) to address distance issues. Logically it would be more efficient and cost-effective to expand the scope of an existing program in the State rather than launching a new one. For example, the College of Applied Science and Technology has partnered with Belmont College to offer the Bachelor of Science in Surveying and Mapping. Working with Belmont faculty and administration, we (UA) have developed an associate degree pathway that, with only six bridge courses, will transfer seamlessly into the BS degree. The BS degree courses will be offered on the campus of Belmont College in St. Clairsville beginning Fall 2018. With only 12% of the Fall 2013 entering cohort (as defined by the Three-Year Success Measures January 2017 report on the ODHE website) earning a two-year degree at CSTCC by the end of the third year, it is unclear how many students will be able to persist to complete a bachelor’s degree.

Comment: 
The data cited by The University of Akron is taken from an ODHE report that was specifically produced in an attempt to provide a more accurate measure of success for two-year campuses as compared to the more traditional graduation measurements that have been focused exclusively on institutions whose business model is built around primarily serving full-time students.  The conclusion of the ODHE report was to say that the REAL three-year success rate of Cincinnati State Technical & Community College is 44%.  To cite only the 12% graduation rate from that report is either purposefully or inadvertently misleading.   While 94% of the freshman class at the University of Akron does enroll as full time students according to ODHE data, only 34% of Cincinnati State students are able to attend full time for a wide variety of personal reasons.  We would be happy to provide numerous examples of students who took longer than three years to complete their degree because they were raising a family, working to support a family, or caring for a beloved family member.  Regardless of their journey, when these part-time students do eventually graduate, they are nothing but success stories. Their achievements should be celebrated.  We hope our colleagues at The University of Akron would agree.  

Comment: 
I am writing today to advocate on behalf of Cincinnati State and to support their pursuit of your approval to begin offering a bachelor’s degree program in the field of Land Surveying. My firm is a 160 plus year old professional services firm located in Cincinnati. We owe part of our continued success to the availability of young, upcoming professionals graduating from colleges with architecture, engineering and landscape architecture degrees. The Land Surveying profession in southwest Ohio, southeast Indiana and northern Kentucky however is experiencing a shortage of young professionals who may ultimately seek their professional surveyor registration in a large part due to the lack of opportunity to acquire a four year degree in Land Surveying. We have a long history of supporting the educational efforts of Cincinnati State’s surveying program. Currently, we have no less than seven members of the survey department who have graduated, or are in the process of working towards graduation, currently employed. I myself am a 1977 graduate of the surveying program. We fully expect to continue our reliance on Cincinnati State to provide upcoming candidates.The demand for surveying professionals is very high and will only continue to grow with a dwindling supply of young professionals. There is no other college in southwest Ohio who is better positioned to make an immediate impact on our profession than Cincinnati State. To the best of my knowledge they have nearly all of the necessary tools to immediately launch this new four year degree. Your approval of Cincinnati State’s application to provide a four year degree program would be greatly appreciated.

Comment: 
My involvement as a Cincinnati State co-op employer and program advisor and my position as chair of the Tristate Surveyor's Advisory Board (TSAB) has helped me understand and appreciate the value of Cincinnati State and its survey program to the Greater Cincinnati survey community. As Professional Land Surveyors of Ohio (PLSO) statewide education committee chair I have been able to witness the needs of our profession throughout the state with regards to education requirements for licensure. My 25 years of involvement in the program at Cincinnati State has enabled me to see first hand the College's commitment to both the students and employers. I hope that I can convey the importance and positive impact that the Applied Bachelors Degree in Land Surveying would have on the future of our local survey community as we look forward to being part of this effort to allow a bachelor degree at certain community colleges. I truly believe that the survey program at Cincinnati State is a perfect fit to the model that the Governor, Chancellor and State Legislators envisioned for this game changing legislation.

Comment: 
I am a CSTC/NKU graduate.I set on the Kentucky Association of Professional Board of Directors, and am active with my local chapter. I also hire co-op students from CSTC with the goal of bringing them on as full time staff. Our profession in SW Ohio and NKY needs this. We require a BS in both Ohio and Kentucky for licensure, but don't offer a "one stop" solution, if you will. This is a much more affordable, much less cumbersome path, which I believe will make the choice of Land Surveying a little more alluring to students. The curriculum that I went through at CSTC was excellent. The instructors at CSTC are Land Surveyors who can relate the message in the class room to real life survey experience. Due to the declining enrollment of Land Surveyors, I have hired non-survey students from necessity. Their learning curve is tremendous in comparison with CSTC students. From a business perspective, having a pool of students available to hire would be awesome. Please make this happen.

Comment: 
As a small business owner of a land surveying firm I can attest to the need for a program in the southern part of the state which will provide a pathway to a bachelor’s degree for those interested in pursuing a career in land surveying. The pathway presently available is convoluted and lacking in advancing the core surveying curriculum. As I look at my peers of a similar age I question from where will the next generation of surveyors come? I am a long ago graduate (1972) of the surveying program at Cincinnati State and a long time employer of student co-ops from the program. The school has done an excellent job instilling the basics skills required of our profession but the time has come to allow the school to complete the job of educating these candidates to the level required for seeking registration as a professional surveyor. Too many of the Associate graduates are not provided the pathway and incentive of continuing their studies within the confines of an institution with the passion for land surveying that Cincinnati State presents.

Comment: 
The Cincinnati State program has helped produce many Professional Surveyors over the years. As times have changed and 4 year degrees are now required for licensure the state needs to assure that there are sufficient programs for people to become eligible for registration. As an employee of the Department of Transportation the department has concerns about the ability to find future surveyors. The surveyors who represent the department are certainly in agreement that there needs to be adequate programs thru out the state to assure that we have qualified individuals to lead the surveying profession into the future.

Comment: 
We should remove the current obstacles that are in place that make the Land Surveying degree not attractive to students. It is already a challenge to attract individuals to a career in construction. If a student is interested in pursuing a degree in the construction field we would all benefit from providing local programs that are focused on surveying and convenient to obtain.

Comment: 
I intend to enroll in this needed program at CSTCC. While I was a student at Cincy St. I began to enjoy education for the first time in my life. I graduated with the A.A.S. in Surveying at Cincy St. in 1991 and proceeded to earn a B. A. in another field because of the awesome learning experience I had at Cincy St. The faculty at Cincy St. gave me such a solid foundation in surveying that I was able to gain licensure in Kentucky on my first attempt nearly 20 years after graduation and after being in another career for 12 years. I have been trying to pursue a B.S. in surveying since 2007 so that I can be licensed in Ohio. I even began classes at a College in Colorado only to see it close before I could complete my degree. I have two children in elementary and two in college so a move to the Akron area or enrolling in a B.S.C.E. program is not practical. Boundary surveying is what attracted me to surveying and I feel blessed to be able to work in this field and strengthen the company that I serve. Every month of the year I hear people in various NW Ohio counties tell me that they cannot even get a surveyor to provide a quote after leaving messages for weeks or even months. This shortage of available surveyors is only getting more critical in the more rural counties. The State needs to allow more direct paths into the profession of surveying and Cincy St. has proven that they are committed to providing that path with proven results.

Comment: 
The ability for Cincinnati State to obtain an accreditation for a four year BS Land Surveying Degree is monumental for the future of this profession, both in the public and private sectors. I am a graduate of Cincinnati State Technical College with an Associate Degree. To have Cincinnati State provide a stand alone four year BS degree that could serve the entire Tri-State area. This would ease the ability of a student to full fill the requirements of Ohio, Kentucky and Indiana State Boards for Licensure. I know the educators that lead the program at the college and they are dedicated to the Surveying program. I currently work for Greater Cincinnati Water Works. We have students COOP with us and some become full time employees. This BS Surveying program would ensure that the southwestern portion of the state continues to cultivate a new and sustainable workforce for years to come. I fully support the development and implementation of this degree and look forward to seeing the Surveying Profession benefit as a result.

Comment: 
There are many great reasons why this program should be approved for Cincinnati State and I am excited about what this opportunity could mean. We all are aware of the shortage of talent in specific industries. High caliber professionals in land surveying is one of those industries. I feel one reason is due to the educational path that a young student must take in order to obtain his bachelors degree / license in Land Surveying. Students are forced to go to separate colleges in order to obtain this goal. Many students we have interviewed / hired all have the same story “this career path has many obstacles that pushes talented students into different fields”. Many students know that their goal is to obtain a 4 year degree out of high school and may pass over a great institution like Cincinnati State because of the simply fact of having to transfer down the road. I work for a company in a large / stable industry and we work exclusively with Cincinnati State to find talent from this program year in and year out. We have found that Cincinnati State does any amazing job using up to date technology, practices, and processes to prepare students for their careers. The skills they learn and the real life experience they gain from the coop program is so valueable to our company and the industry. This industry is in an exciting place right now in terms of technology. There are so many cutting edge things that this degree / career would allow for. I know this would attract many students around the United States who have a passion for STEM careers to Cincinnati State. I hope that all of the support for this program will encourage you to allow Cincinnati State to prove what they can do with this opportunity. Many companies are relying on initiviates like this to keep moving us in the right direction.

Comment: 
General comments that apply to all applied baccalaureate degree program submissions: These RFI submissions do not currently provide sufficient information to fully determine (1) whether duplication exists with other programs in the state; (2) the ability of the proposed programs to meet rigorous standards for accreditation, and; (3) the ability to assess market potential for programs. With respect to accreditation by discipline-specific accrediting bodies, the State of Ohio via the universities has spent significant time, energy and funds over many decades to achieve and maintain accredited program status. This investment is about quality, and ensures that when Ohio citizens graduate in one of these programs they have the knowledge and skills needed by employers. It makes little sense to use additional state resources to attempt to start new programs at community colleges that overlap with existing programs, and that will face long processes and costly investments to attempt to achieve the same status already held by university-based programs. Cincinnati State - BS in Land Surveying: It is unclear that the proposed program would be able to achieve ABET accreditation. Univ of Akron and Ohio State offer highly-acclaimed and accredited surveying programs. Univ of Akron's program offers online/hybrid options. Ohio Univ offers a land surveying curriculum within its civil engineering bachelor's degree program, resulting in better career options through dual licensure. IUC recommends that Cincinnati State CC consider a collaborative approach such as a guaranteed transfer pathway, which would be more efficient and practical.

Comment: 
Chancellor Carey: I am writing in response to the Department’s request for public comment related to the Ohio Department of Higher Education establishing a program under which community colleges, state community colleges, and technical colleges may apply to offer applied bachelor’s degrees. As stated in House Bill 49, community colleges can apply to the Ohio Department of Higher Education to offer applied science bachelor’s degrees. One of the requirements of the law is that a degree can only be approved if there is an “absence of a bachelor's degree program that meets the workforce need addressed by the proposed program that is offered by a state university or private college or university.” To that end, AICUO has serious concerns about the following degrees that are currently offered by nonprofit institutions in Ohio: Bachelor of Science in Land Surveying Cedarville University: offers a bachelor of science in geology and civil engineering (the latter has been approved by DHE and HLC and will start the fall of 2018), both of which have land surveying elements in the degree. It is clear that students in Ohio already have multiple post-secondary program options that “meet the workforce need” of these proposed programs. Again, since Ohio Revised Code Section 3333.051 clearly states a bachelor’s degree proposed field cannot already be offered, it is very apparent that these programs should be denied approval. Many of the aforementioned institutions have provided their individual comments to your office on the proposed degrees as well. However, please be aware that given the short, near-Christmas timetable, this is not a complete reflection of every non-profit institution’s offerings in Ohio. We encourage the Department to reopen the public comment for more appropriate and well-rounded feedback to ensure that this process is not rushed through with unnecessary haste utilizing truncated feedback. Given the duplicative nature of the proposed degrees, AICUO firmly believes the law should be followed and these degrees should be rejected. Sincerely, C. Todd Jones President & General Counsel AICUO

Comment: 
The AICUO seems to be misinterpreting the law as passed by the Ohio General Assembly.  The law does NOT say that a degree cannot be approved simply because there is an existing bachelor’s degree program in existence somewhere else in the state.  Instead, the language says that the Chancellor may approve a program if the local workforce need is not met, including if it is not being met by another university offering a similar program.  This is an interpretation that has been agreed to by Ohio Department of Higher Education’s legal counsel. This law has always been about meeting the workforce needs of Ohio employers. As clearly evidenced by the support of local employers contained within the degree proposal and through public comments, they believe that their workforce needs are not being met.  

Comment: 
There is a need throughout Ohio for land surveying programs which offer a bachelor degree. There is currently just one such program and it is located in Akron. Southwest Ohio and other parts of the State are without local options, creating undue hardship and financial difficulty for potential students. The Ohio Revised Code requires county engineers to have dual registration – Professional Engineer (P.E.) and Professional Surveyor (P.S.). Obtaining these licenses is a long and difficult task, so much so that there has been talk of dropping the P.S. requirement to hold the office of county engineer. But rather than reduce qualifications to become a county engineer, I believe we should provide more opportunities for students and prospective office holders to obtain their professional surveyor’s license. This would help provide more candidates for the county engineer’s office. Moreover, many surveyors today are in an aging demographic. If we are to keep the field more open to a diversity of potential county engineers, it is imperative that we provide easier means to interested students who wish to pursue a career that involves land surveying Cincinnati State offers an excellent land surveying program that produces high quality students and serves this part of the southwest Ohio / Tri-State area. I encourage your support of a Bachelor of Science degree in Land Surveying at Cincinnati State Technical and Community College. -- Greg Wilkens, P.E., P.S., Butler County Engineer

Comment: 
The name of the proposed program should include the word “applied,” to more accurately communicate the nature of the degree. <br> While OHIO does offer a land surveying option under the Civil Engineering Bachelor’s Degree, Cincinnati State’s program would not be in direct competition. Ohio University’s program is more aimed at developing dual licensure—as professional engineer and professional land surveyor. There are very few land surveyors in the State of Ohio, and even fewer dual licenses. <br> There are still many opportunities for creating new articulation pathways that could further enable community colleges to position themselves as the starting point toward a four-year bachelor’s degree of the kinds they are proposing. While not a lot of information has been provided to evaluate the proposed programs, we already see opportunities for articulation that have not been fully explored. The ODHE’s recent mandate to develop regional compacts could catalyze such discussions. For our part, OHIO already has 21 articulation agreements with community colleges statewide that include a provision enabling students who successfully complete their two-year programs to participate in our OHIO Guarantee, at the tuition schedule in effect when they started at the community college. In addition, there are any number of areas in which community colleges could be developing new two-year programs that equip students to compete successfully in Ohio’s job market. Cybersecurity and data analytics are two examples: growing fields where basic skill development is critical. Some community colleges are developing these programs, but as the demand is large and growing, there is plenty of room for more two-year programs in these fields. When higher-education institutions engage with each other as partners rather than competitors, they can collaborate in ways that leverage the unique strengths of each and yield more creative solutions to the challenge of increasing access and affordability.

Comment: 
I am writing asking for your support in Cincinnati State’s pursuit of a bachelor’s degree program in the field of Land Surveying. Having been a longtime supporter of Cincinnati State’s co-op program, and employer of its graduates, it is evident that the existing program is an outstanding one. However, the challenges in obtaining a bachelor’s degree, necessary for licensure, has clearly affected the workforce in southern Ohio. It has become extremely difficult to find new young talent. An easier path for students in the pursuit for a bachelor’s degree in Land Surveying will fulfill an important need. Help me help a profession that has given me so much by supporting Cincinnati State’s goal.

Comment: 
The AICUO seems to be misinterpreting the law as passed by the Ohio General Assembly.  The law does NOT say that a degree cannot be approved simply because there is an existing bachelor’s degree program in existence somewhere else in the state.  Instead, the language says that the Chancellor may approve a program if the local workforce need is not met, including if it is not being met by another university offering a similar program.  This is an interpretation that has been agreed to by Ohio Department of Higher Education’s legal counsel. This law has always been about meeting the workforce needs of Ohio employers. As clearly evidenced by the support of local employers contained within the degree proposal and through public comments, they believe that their workforce needs are not being met.  

Comment: 
As the older generation of surveyors are retiring there is a large amount of knowledge and principals of the profession going with them. I believe that a BS program through CSTC would help fill this void. The professors with CSTC can take a student that has never even heard of surveying and turn them in a PS. I am only one example of this. The staff at CSTC are knowledgeable and bring real world knowledge and practices into the classroom. A program that will help streamline this process will be a huge asset to getting students to sick with the program and become licensed. When I took my test a few years ago there was only seven people taking the survey exam. The amount of qualified professional surveyors is shrinking and this program will be a huge asset in growing the profession. The current path to obtain the required education for a surveying license is not a direct one. The streamlining of this process will only help ensure the future of our aging profession.